FRAN KELLY:
The vaccine rollout continues to gather pace as the nation closes in on 70 per cent of the adult population, receiving at least their first dose. The Government's now issuing a call to business to set up their own in-house vaccination programs. It's also launching a vaccination blitz in 30 vulnerable Indigenous communities, where immunisation rates are still well below the national levels. Lieutenant General John Frewen is head of the National COVID Taskforce. John Frewen, welcome back to Breakfast.
JOHN FREWEN:
Thanks, Fran, good to be with you.
FRAN KELLY:
We're almost at 70 percent of adults receiving the first vaccines now, but only 43 per cent have their second dose. Given how we're going, when will we hit 70 per cent and then 80 per cent double dose? The key targets in the national plan to open up?
JOHN FREWEN:
So, Fran, public sentiment surveys around vaccination are very strong, very encouraging. They're showing that more than 80 per cent of the population intend to get vaccinated, and then there's still another group making up their mind and a very small group who are saying they won't get vaccinated. We've now got the adequate vaccine supplies, we've got the points of presence that are being put in place that I think will give everybody easy and ready access to vaccines. So, it really now is just about people turning up.
On current projections, we can get to 70 per cent in October, but it really just does come down to the public continuing to step forward as they have been doing, which is great. So, I just encourage everybody to keep getting those bookings in.
FRAN KELLY:
So, if we've got the supply as of now and certainly over the next month, it's about people turning up, we could get to 70 percent by, what, mid-October, did you say? What about 80 per cent?
JOHN FREWEN:
Well, I mean, we- on the current projections, it is possible to get to 80 per cent this year, but the variable here is people and people's preparedness to get vaccinated. I said the- the numbers look encouraging, but I've just- you know, watching overseas experience, getting from 70 to 80 is hard work. So, I'm not going to, you know, be sort of complacent or count those chickens just yet.
So, really good signs, really great opportunity here to get 80 per cent done this year, but it's about people encouraging others encouraging their communities to get along and get vaccinated. Because, you know, this is a collective endeavour and it's the collective effect of vaccination that's going to allow us to open up again.
FRAN KELLY:
And are you contemplating some kind of incentive scheme for that final sort of push, for the final sort of 10 per cent who are still thinking about it, given that some definitely won't?
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah. Well, at the moment, again, our- all the indications are that what people respond to most is choice, convenience and getting their freedoms back, and that- those things at the moment are driving these more than 80 per cent of people who are willing to get vaccinated. And I think they will also have a positive impact on that 10 to 15 per cent who are still making up their mind as well.
So, at the moment, we don't need other types of incentives. Some industries are already putting some great initiatives in place and that's really helpful. But we'll continue to monitor and as we get closer to those higher numbers, then we'll keep reviewing and making decisions as we go.
FRAN KELLY:
Just in terms of choice and convenience, I should pass on to you comments I've been getting from listeners really for weeks now, but also more insistently in the last week or two since the teenage rollout has been opened up because people, particularly around the Newcastle area, saying Pfizer for teenagers, the waiting list is so long, people are being told December is the earliest for their jab. People are waiting on the phone- I've had a number of callers tell me they've waited on the phone for hours, if not days. They've tried for days and just- and they’re keep being told, you know, there's plenty around. You can get your teenager vaccinated now and they say they can't. It's not true. Are you hearing that? Are you concerned about that? And are you doing something about it?
JOHN FREWEN:
Look, it's- there is a bit of a variable experience around the countryside, but with the amounts of mRNA vaccine that we've got turning up over the next couple of weeks, both Pfizer and Moderna, I'm seeing more and more bookings being opened up.
So, I would just encourage those people to get back on the phones and just see whether more bookings have been opened up. And hopefully, they'll be able to get some early bookings because we are seeing that in quite a number of jurisdictions and we're seeing very, very fast bookings as well. We've had 12- to 15-year-old numbers rising steadily and we only opened on Monday.
FRAN KELLY:
The 70 and 80 per cent targets are nationwide. How do you make sure the coverage is across the board? That vulnerable communities won't be left behind? And is that your job as the leader of this rollout to identify those vulnerabilities and close them down now? What are you doing?
JOHN FREWEN:
Yes. So we are very concerned about this, Fran, and we've been keeping a close eye on it. Now you've mentioned we've got a particular plan around Indigenous communities and we can talk about that. We've also been doing analysis about where the lowest rates are across the country writ large. And I think inside those numbers there is disadvantaged and hard to reach communities, and they're of similar concern to us as the Indigenous populations at the moment. So we're developing plans to make sure that we try and bring the rollout along as equitably as we can, because there will be increasing momentum as we get towards 70 and 80 per cent in demand for opening up the country and opening up the economy and those sorts of things. So I want to make sure all these communities are as well protected as they can be before that happens.
FRAN KELLY:
If we hit 80 per cent - and we haven't hit 80 per cent in some of these most vulnerable communities, and we'll talk about the Indigenous communities now - will we open up? Would that be your advice or not?
JOHN FREWEN:
Well, that's a government decision. And the policy at the moment is that when the nation is at 70 and 80 per cent and when all the states and territories are at 70 and 80 per cent, then government will make decisions based around that. We've certainly raised the issue of inequality. It's being discussed. It is of concern. So my job is to try and now bring these communities along as quickly as we can and the Indigenous community is our number one priority right now.
FRAN KELLY:
All right. And as the listeners keep pointing out, when we say 80 per cent, we are talking 80 per cent of the adult population. Only 22 per cent of First Nations people- First Australians aged over 12 are fully vaccinated. About 40 per cent has received one dose. In some communities, the figures are much lower than that. These Indigenous communities we know are particularly vulnerable to a Delta outbreak. Are you aiming for 100 per cent coverage in this blitz, that 80 per cent won't be enough?
JOHN FREWEN:
Well, I would like 100 per cent of all Australians or people in Australia to be vaccinated, but so of course we- we’re ...
FRAN KELLY:
[Interrupts] But this is a particularly vulnerable community.
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah, no, look Fran, we will work to close the gap as fast as we can, and we will be working to get every single person in these communities vaccinated. But right now, it's about getting the numbers up and getting them closer to where the national averages are. I mean, there has been a plan in place for Indigenous communities right from the start. And the reason why there’s ...
FRAN KELLY:
[Talks over] It hasn't worked, obviously.
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah. Well, there's a couple of reasons which are understandable. I mean, AstraZeneca was rolled out as a priority very early in the program. And then of course, we had the reputational issues that developed around that. So that was a bit of a setback. In some of the remote regional areas, the logistics of the mRNA vaccine was a bit more complex. But what we've got now is there are some communities that have done really, really well, but there are many, many that haven't. So what we've done now is we've done the analysis. We've identified the 30 areas where the biggest gaps are. There are a mix of remote and non-remote, and some of those are where the biggest populations are as well. So we're now working really closely with the states and territories, with the NACCHOs, with Royal Flying Doctor and other providers, closely engaged with Pat Turner and Dawn Casey. We've consolidated this list of 30 priority areas now and we're about to go after it in sort of a comprehensive way.
FRAN KELLY:
Some would say it's a bit late, but let's move on from that. How are you going to do it? We keep hearing from local Indigenous communities where outbreaks are- [indistinct], you know, we need people going door to door with this. Are you actually going to have those kind of resources on the ground?
JOHN FREWEN:
Yes, so we've- we're looking very closely at western New South Wales and other areas where there has either been good success or rapid change has been made. We've now- we're building very specific plans for each of these 30. And as I've said, things have been happening in these places already. And even over the last month, we've gone from 26 per cent first dose, up to 40 per cent first dose. So we are starting to get a bit of a momentum in there. The communities are keeping pace with the national percentages, but not- but the gap is there. So we've got to close that gap now. We're looking at things like additional doses, additional funding. We're getting additional staff into some areas, we're getting visits from the RFDS in the sort of areas that haven't gotten scheduled just now. We're looking at super clinics and family days and lots and lots of communications, Fran, because the hesitancy is one of the most significant things through many of these communities. And it's taken root and it's hard to shift, but we've got to get the right information. We've got to get the right local leadership pushing the vaccination message. And we've got people to understand this is urgent and they've got to protect not just themselves, but their communities.
FRAN KELLY:
John Frewen, thank you for joining us again on Breakfast.
JOHN FREWEN:
Thanks, Fran.
FRAN KELLY:
Lieutenant General John Frewen.
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