REBECCA LEVINGSTON:
When will Australia be vaccinated to a point where you're protected from COVID, lockdowns stop, and borders reopen? You heard the Prime Minister roll out the roadmap and then he passed the plan to Lieutenant General John Frewen, who is head of the National COVID Vaccine Taskforce. Good morning, General Frewen.
JOHN FREWEN:
Hi, Rebecca, great to be with you.
REBECCA LEVINGSTON:
As of today, how many Australians are vaccinated with their first and second dose?
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah, so look, we're making great progress in the rollout now. We've hit 14 million doses that have been administered nationwide and that translates into more than nine million Australians have had their first dose. That's about 44 per cent of the population. And we've got just shy of five million now who are fully vaccinated. That's about 23 per cent of the population.
REBECCA LEVINGSTON:
What's the goal by Christmas?
JOHN FREWEN:
Look, the primary goal I've got is to make sure that every Australian who wants to access a vaccine this year can do so. And I'm very confident we'll do that. But we're also driving very hard now at making sure that if we can get 70 per cent of the population fully vaccinated, that we do that as early as we can this year.
REBECCA LEVINGSTON:
How many vaccine doses has Australia got on order? Let's start with Pfizer.
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah, so we'll - by the end of the year, we'll have 40 million doses of Pfizer, so the challenge there is we will get those by the end of the year. It's just been how early we've been able to access those. So, you might have seen, probably about a month ago, we managed to get a bring forward from September into July and August, which was great. But the large amounts of the Pfizer will still turn up in October and November.
REBECCA LEVINGSTON:
Yeah, that was interesting when the Prime Minister announced that he'd been able to bring forward that vaccine supply. How did he do that? And can we keep doing that?
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah, look, you know, there is- this is a, you know, a terrible global pandemic and there is intense demand for these vaccines. I was just speaking with the national leadership of Pfizer yesterday. They are producing these vaccines as quickly as they can but they're managing their distribution around the world where, you know, everybody wants them as fast as they can get them. And they're trying to do that in a way that is very deliberative and equitable. So, you know, we, like many other countries, are working with Pfizer as closely as we can. They're working on producing it as fast as they can. And sometimes, you know, there might be a little bit more available, a little bit less available. And we've just got to be ready to make sure that if there's a little bit more, that we're ready to get into people's arms.
REBECCA LEVINGSTON:
Yeah but I guess it's just curious because it's like, well, did Australia get someone else's supply? Did they suddenly pump them out faster?
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah, no, look, sometimes it's about pumping them out faster, you know, things happen on production lines that, you know, that allow you to sometimes go faster, sometimes go a bit slower. But we're also looking where we can around the world for where there might be opportunities. So, it's a constant process. But of course, we've got fantastic suppliers of AstraZeneca here, we've got domestic production of AstraZeneca going on.
REBECCA LEVINGSTON:
Yeah and of those one million AstraZeneca doses manufactured in Australia, how many administered - how many are administered here and how many are sent overseas?
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah, so, look, AstraZeneca has really been the workhorse of the rollout to date. Of the 14 million doses that have been administered, about 7.5 million of those have been AstraZeneca here domestically. And right at the moment, because of the terrible outbreaks in, you know, Sydney and other places, there is increasing demand for AstraZeneca, which is good to see, because it's a really safe and effective vaccine. And it's really important that people get whatever vaccine they can as fast as they can. But we've now sent more than 1.5 million doses out into the Pacific where they've been really well received, particularly, you know, in Fiji, where, you know, they've had real challenges with community transmission. So, they've been greatly appreciative that we've been able to get them AstraZeneca really quickly.
REBECCA LEVINGSTON:
You're listening to Lieutenant General John Frewen. He is the coordinator of the National COVID Vaccine Taskforce. General, I hope we can get to some of your own background because it is extraordinary to look at your career that's taken you to Rwanda, the Solomon Islands, Afghanistan. And now, here you are heading up a major mission on home soil. But just sticking with the specifics of the vaccines coming in, how many vaccines doses of Moderna are on their way to Australia?
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah. So, we've also- we've got ten million doses of Moderna that we expect by the end of the year. And again, we're hoping that, you know, later this month, ideally, we'll start to see the first of the Moderna and that's another mRNA vaccine like Pfizer. So, it's the same sort of style vaccine. So, that will just be another great addition to our arsenal, and we'll get that rolled out. The plan at the moment is to get that out through the pharmacy network. You've probably seen, we're now bringing on pharmacies at a rate of knots and they're at the moment doing AstraZeneca. But as soon as we've got the Moderna, then people will be able to access an mRNA vaccine through the pharmacist network as well.
REBECCA LEVINGSTON:
Are there any other vaccines on order for Australia?
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah, look, there's another one, Novavax, that later in the year, that's a different style, again, that will be a third style of vaccine but that one's still sort of pending approval. But you can see between the mRNA, the Moderna, the AstraZeneca we've got, there is more than an ample supply of vaccines that will be available…
REBECCA LEVINGSTON:
[Interrupts] Except that at some point, Australians are going to need booster doses, General. When do you think the first booster shot will be administered?
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah, so look, that's being watched, sort of, closely around the world at the moment and the science is still being, sort of, determined on that but we're already looking for next year. Most of the thinking around boosters at the moment seem to indicate that somewhere between six and 12 months will probably be optimal but we're already doing planning for a booster rollout through next year.
REBECCA LEVINGSTON:
There's been a little bit of confusion for a couple of reasons between the states and the Federal Government, different advice to people, and also, even at times, our own Queensland Health Minister surprised to hear of bonus doses of the vaccine. Who is your Queensland point of contact?
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah, so look, I work at a number of levels with the state and territory authorities but for the fine detail of the rollout, I'm dealing with Commissioner Shane Chelepy there. So, you know, we're exchanging phone calls regularly about lower level details but I go to National Cabinet so, you know, I get to brief the premier there. I'm involved with the First Secretaries Group. I'm involved in the Health Minister's meetings. I'm involved in the meetings with the Health CEOs and Chief Health Officers. And I also have a weekly coordination mission with all of the leads for the states and territories as well, So it's comprehensive…
REBECCA LEVINGSTON:
[Talks over] Yes.
JOHN FREWEN:
…but we're well connected.
REBECCA LEVINGSTON:
And how do you divvy up the doses to different states and territories? Is it by population? Is it by need?
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah, so we- the approach that we've taken strictly through this is a per capita allocation, because it's important that, you know, every Australian gets equitable access, so a per capita allocation across the states and territories does that but we're also, in a national rollout like this, it's important that we try and bring the whole nation along at a similar pace because, you know, even though you get hotspots in areas, I mean this thing can move, particularly the Delta variant we've seen move very quickly, so we've got to try and bring up that level of protection as equally as we can.
REBECCA LEVINGSTON:
And moving to school too, General Frewen, I mean Brisbane, we're just emerging from a cluster where dozens of children, some of them very young, contracted the Delta variant. When will school age children be vaccinated?
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah, look, we're looking very closely at that at the moment. You might have seen recently the modelling done by the Doherty Institute. That's shifting our thinking a little bit around prioritising just the most vulnerable. Now we're going to prioritise the most vulnerable and those high transmissibility groups. Now, they tend to be in the 20 to 39 age bracket, so they're our next highest priority. But we're working with all of the states and territories right now about when we might look to, perhaps a national school-based rollout for school children.
REBECCA LEVINGSTON:
Any idea of a time frame on that?
JOHN FREWEN:
Oh, look, it's probably likely this year, but the details are really still being worked out and as we get additional, you know, vaccines available, we talked about getting mRNA that might come sort of forward in the year.
REBECCA LEVINGSTON:
Yes.
JOHN FREWEN:
It's really as we get that available, that we can start to make decisions about bringing in additional groups as a priority.
REBECCA LEVINGSTON:
So, would school children get Moderna?
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah. The approvals are still being finalised on Moderna but an mRNA vaccine I think will be the most likely for the school children.
REBECCA LEVINGSTON:
Lieutenant General John Frewen, who is the head of National COVID Vaccine Taskforce. I know you've got a tight schedule today. Do you have two minutes, just to give us a bit of background on you, given you're playing such a pivotal role. What is your background before you came to this coordinator role?
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah. So look, I came straight out of school into Duntroon and then into a long career in the Army, predominantly in the sort of infantry and rapid deployment area and, you know, you've mentioned some of those, you know, operational areas that I've been to, Rwanda and the Solomons and Iraq and Afghanistan but in the most recent couple of years, I had an extraordinary experience where I was sent to the Australian Signals Directorate for a couple of years. That was something I didn't have a background in but being inside that intelligence community, and particularly in the cyber sort of area, was absolutely fascinating. And then I was asked at sort of short notice to take on the Defence COVID Taskforce and I did that for about 15 months. And then at short notice, again, I was asked to come across and run the national vaccine rollout. So, I've been working in the COVID space, you know, for the best part of two years now. So, a lot of it's very familiar but right now I'm really focussed on getting vaccines into arms and getting the nation vaccinated as quickly as we can.
REBECCA LEVINGSTON:
Who called? Was it the PM?
JOHN FREWEN:
Yes. The PM, sort of, made the decision and he sent me a letter telling me what he'd like me to do and that's what I'm doing.
REBECCA LEVINGSTON:
Well, it's a huge responsibility and no doubt you need all Australians to get on board with the road map with you, so I guess why it's important to some extent for Australians to get to know you, have you got a nickname?
JOHN FREWEN:
I'm known as JJ colloquially, there's nothing more creative than that, that I'm aware of but I'm sure there may well be something else out there.
REBECCA LEVINGSTON:
Well, JJ, General Frewen, appreciate your time this morning. Thanks so much. We'll keep in touch.
JOHN FREWEN:
No worries, Rebecca. Great to talk.
REBECCA LEVINGSTON:
Lieutenant General John Frewen.
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