NEIL MITCHELL:
Okay, we've spoken occasionally to the coordinator for National COVID Vaccine Taskforce, the man in charge of getting us vaccinated, Lieutenant General John Frewen. Good morning.
JOHN FREWEN:
Morning, Neil. Great to be with you.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Thank you for your time. Now, I think we all agree we need some hope. And if you look at the current trends and the estimates I'm seeing, the modelling, 70 per cent of the eligible population could be fully vaccinated by November 17, five weeks before Christmas. Are we right to feel hopeful that we could have 70 per cent done by November?
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah, Neil, look, I personally wouldn't be assigning such a specific date but I think between the supply we've got coming in, the distribution network that we've got in place, as long as Australians keep turning up, I think we've got a really fantastic opportunity at getting to 70 per cent before the end of the year.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Okay, so no specific date, but just towards the end of the year, you reckon?
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah, it's all about people in Australia turning up. So, I'm really encouraged at the moment with the way the population are responding to vaccination. I mean, the vast majority of Australians have indicated they are intending to get vaccinated and as long as they keep doing that, then we'll certainly be able to get to those sorts of numbers.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Do you expect a bit of resistance at the end? I mean, a lot of people going out now but there might be some at the end who are saying- there's sort of, if you like, a rump that doesn't want to be vaccinated?
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah. So, look, pleasingly again, that's a smaller percentage of the population but we're really focused on them because some of them, it's just about education. Some of them it's just about having to sort of better understand the real importance and urgency around the vaccine rollout and I think as we go later into the year, we'll have more and more vaccines available. We'll be able to offer people greater choice of vaccines and there'll be greater convenience in how they can get vaccinated. So hopefully between- if we get the messaging right and we can make it simple for people to get vaccinated and people can have more of a choice around which vaccines, and we'll hopefully get those people on the right side of the line.
NEIL MITCHELL:
What percentage do you estimate that you're going to have trouble with that rump, if you like? What percentage?
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah, look, the estimates I've got at the moment say that it's probably side of 20 per cent, which is really pleasing. So, we've got well more than 70 per cent of Australians are saying that they will get it done. So that's great. And then we've got that sort of next band to deal with and then there's a much smaller cohort of those people who are firmly resistant at this stage. So, the broad numbers get us into high percentages if people get along and get vaccinated and they're doing that at the moment. So, I'm really pleased by that and I really encourage everybody who hasn't made a booking yet to get booked in.
NEIL MITCHELL:
What does your modelling say about getting 80 per cent of the population double-vaxxed? If we- 70 per cent by the end of the year, when is 80 per cent?
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah, look, if everything went right and everybody turned up in droves, we've got another opportunity for 80 per cent this year but whether it's sort of this year or early next year, it really comes down to that, the willingness of the population to step forward. So those people who've been vaccinated help others understand what the process is like, understand your experience with getting the vaccine and we've just got to keep pushing the really positive message, this is so important to individuals and to groups and to us as a nation. Because as you've seen now from the sort of Doherty modelling that's been released, we really can't get back to that sort of lifestyle that we want to until we get to those higher vaccination rates nationally.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Do you think it's helping convince people? I mean, there is reality, isn't it, that if you're not vaccinated to come a certain period, then towards the end of this year, next year, you won't be having the same privileges as people who are vaccinated.
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah and I think that's just a reality. That's not a- that's not meant to be a sort of pointed message but you look internationally right now, the ability to travel internationally, the ability to move freely around some countries that we're seeing in other places overseas, even the ability to go to sporting events and into cafes and things like that comes down to being vaccinated. Now, we're sort of still working through all of those processes but there will be, I think, tangible benefits to being vaccinated beyond those sheer health effects that are so important.
NEIL MITCHELL:
What- how's the drive through going out at Milton? Have you had any figures on that?
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah, look, I haven't actually got figures available, but I did see some footage of it yesterday. It looked like it was going at a great pace but I'm keen to see how that's going, because very quickly off the mark down there and they've got it going and that's an option, a creative option, and we're looking for all of those sorts of opportunities to just bring more and more convenience to the to the process of getting vaccinated.
NEIL MITCHELL:
So, we're likely to see more drive throughs?
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah, I think it's really up to the states and territories whether they want to go down drive throughs but we're looking at, you know, pop up clinics. We're looking at, you know, workplace vaccinations. We're working with industry right now about workplace vaccination. So there's lots of, you know, good ideas, lots of, you know, I think, ways that we can, you know, offer vaccination as we go further into the year that, you know, should give people no practical reasons for not getting vaccinated.
NEIL MITCHELL:
I was talking to Greg Hunt yesterday, the Health Minister, about Moderna and when it's likely to arrive. I noticed overnight they were due to deliver 8.5 million doses to South Korea this month and they've had to apologise - said because of production issues, they're getting about less than half that. Is there a possibility that our Moderna delivery could be affected by production deliveries as well?
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah, look, I'm not seeing anything that would indicate that, but we always- you know, we're always extremely cautious. There is intense global demand for these vaccines. We're working very closely with the vaccine providers. You've probably seen, you know, we don't announce what we're getting until it's been absolutely confirmed that we're getting it. We've got contracts in place that we know how much we will get by the end of the year but how that gets sequenced prior to that can be a bit variable. But, you know, the positive thing is the contracts that are in place, we, you know, we've got great domestic production of AstraZeneca here. We've got 40 million doses of Pfizer that will be here by the end of the year. We're looking forward to 10 million doses of Moderna. So, there is absolutely ample vaccines by the end of the year for everybody who wants to get vaccinated that they can.
NEIL MITCHELL:
And you see no suggestion the Moderna could be delayed for us?
JOHN FREWEN:
I don't have any sort of hard information on that right now, Neil. But again, we- you know, if it comes, that's great. If it comes a little bit later, we've got plans in place that we'll be ready to have the distribution nodes ready for people to turn up.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Few people in the sixties have called me and said they're waiting for Pfizer. Will they be entitled to Pfizer when you get enough of it?
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah, look, once we've got enough I intend to offer as much choice as we can, but really, you know, there's an important decision to make about, you know, whether it's best to get vaccinated now or whether you do want to wait, and that's an individual decision and it needs to be a risk based decision as well. You know, particularly in south west Sydney right now where the threat of Delta is really high, you know, we're seeing really good uptake in AstraZeneca for those who can't access the Pfizer, and, you know, that's good to see because that's choice that's being made about the threat and right now, in some of these outbreak areas, the threat is really high and the best way to protect yourself and your communities is through getting vaccinated.
NEIL MITCHELL:
AstraZeneca is really experiencing a bit of a revival isn't it? If we got under 40s embracing it as well, even in Victoria, we're hearing that AstraZeneca is making a comeback in a sense.
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah, absolutely. And so, you know, when the ATAGI made their second announcement about AstraZeneca in mid-June, you know, there was some people who had a view that that might sort of be the death knell for it but there's been 3.5 million doses of it delivered domestically. We've pushed another 1.5 million doses out to the Pacific where it's been eagerly received and since the PM made his announcement late June about AstraZeneca being available to under 40s and informed choice, you know, more than 200,000 Australians under 40 have stepped forward to get their first dose of AstraZeneca so I'm really pleased to see that because that's a- it's a vaccine that we can make here. It's an effective vaccine and it's really important in this fight- you know, in this urgent phase of trying to get our national numbers up.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Thank you very much. Just finally, Novavax, do we know when that will be here?
JOHN FREWEN:
Yeah, no, look, later- last quarter of the year, you know, it's still going through approval processes and that sort of thing, Neil, but that'll be yet another instrument that we'll have at our disposal but, you know, we'll look forward to having that in the fight as well.
NEIL MITCHELL:
General, you must be one of the busiest people in the country. Did you remember to do the census last night?
JOHN FREWEN:
My wife did the census on our behalf, Neil but I was providing moral encouragement while I was preparing for other things.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Thank you very much for your time. Thank you.
JOHN FREWEN:
All right. Cheers, Neil.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Lieutenant General John Frewen, Coordinator of the National COVID Vaccine Taskforce.
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