MURRAY JONES, HOST: Well, we know we've got an ageing population here in Australia. Lots of challenges when it comes to independence, having a dignified time in your later years and I guess making the choice about the things that you want to do. Important discussion because it's a big portfolio. He's a young fellow with quite an extensive portfolio. Sam Rae is the Federal Minister for Aged Care and Seniors. He joins me this morning. Good morning, Sam. How are you today?
SAM RAE, MINISTER FOR AGED CARE AND SENIORS: Good morning, Murray. I'm very well, thank you. Thank you for having me on.
HOST: Wonderful to talk to you. And, I mean, an ageing population right across Australia, but the audience here at 4CA, generally, not always, but generally in the 50-plus realm. So I guess it's a time when we start to need to think about some of the issues moving forward. And when it comes to getting government assistance, you know, the assessment periods and also prioritising, that's one of the key things I understand the Government's been trying to streamline, because I know it's caused a few headaches for people in the past, Sam.
RAE: Well, you're very right, Murray. We do have an ageing population and it is one of the public policy challenges of our time. We are now starting to see the baby boomer generation moving into residential aged care. And of course, we've got older Australians who've worked very hard and made great contributions across the community throughout their lives, requiring some additional assistance to stay in their homes as well. And there's no doubt, Murray, the aged care system, unfortunately, it is a complicated system. It's trying to meet the needs of many different people who want to achieve different things in that later period of their life. And we've always approached this with a principled position, that we want every Australian, no matter where they live, to be able to receive safe, dignified and high-quality aged care. But unfortunately, I don't want to be overly partisan, Murray, but unfortunately, we inherited a system that was degraded, that had been neglected. And of course, that culminated in a damning Royal Commission. And since we were elected three and a half years ago, we have been undergoing a generational reform program, probably the biggest reform program of our Government in terms of its scale. And of course, there's no silver bullet to these challenges. We can't fix everything overnight. We're heading in the right direction, but we're continuing to work with older people, with the sector and with the workforce to achieve those principles, as I said, that every Australian can receive safe, dignified and high-quality aged care.
HOST: And it’s a very expensive process. When you think about the cost of Medicare, the Pharmaceutical Benefits Scheme, the NDIS these days and also aged care, there's a large cost there to Government. So making sure that these services are delivered as accurately and as economically as possible is a major challenge for the Government.
RAE: It certainly is, Murray. There are costs associated with it, and I think of those costs as investments. Again, I make this point. I regularly make this in the conversations that I have. Older Australians have worked incredibly hard. They've made enormous contributions to our society. We as a society, rightly, have an evolving view about what aged care will look like, either for ourselves, for our loved ones, our parents, our grandparents. And of course, what was probably acceptable 20 or 30 years ago is not acceptable under any circumstances today. We certainly have a lot more people that want to age at home, and that's important. It's good for communities. It keeps people close to their communities, close to their loved ones, close to their support structures, allows them to stay in their own homes. And it also is quite efficient from a Government services perspective as well, Murray. So we want to support people to do that. Across our two big programs of in-home support, we've got a new program which began in November called Support at Home, which replaced our old Home Care Packages program. We have a record number of people in that at the moment. We've got about 350,000 people receiving Support at Home. That's more than double what it was five years ago, to give you an idea of that growth trajectory.
And then, we've got a program called Commonwealth Home Support Program, CHSP, which is a lower-level support program. And we've got about 830,000 people across the country, and that costs about $14 billion every single year. So these are investments to make sure that older people can receive the care, the dignified, high quality and safe care that they deserve.
HOST: And look, coming back to I guess one of the main things I was keen to talk about was those assessment periods. I believe the median time, about 23 days. Now, which specific program was that, though?
RAE: So this is the new Single Assessment System, Murray. Previously, there was multiple assessment systems, different assessors, different processes. As I said, this is a complicated system. Part of the reform that we've been going through is to try wherever possible to simplify the system so that older people and their supporters can navigate the system more easily. So we now have a single assessment system where older people go through. They are assessed based on their needs by a qualified assessor in order to then allocate the best services to them. And that might be CHSP services. It might be Support at Home, it might be residential aged care services. It might be something not even within that system – perhaps their needs are lower and they need something that's more in the primary healthcare system that can be managed by their GP. But there's a Single Assessment System. Now, wait times previously had been very difficult across those multiple assessment systems, and we've continued to drive them down over the last 12 months or so that we've had the Single Assessment System in place. And as you point out, that's now down around 24 days as the median wait time, from the time that you sort of plug into the system to the time that you get your assessment completed.
HOST: Okay. And obviously, different levels you're talking about there. You're talking about an entry level when comes to the Commonwealth Home Support program, and then you move through the system. But I guess as soon as you've been assessed and through the system, some of your future needs are probably, I guess, in focus to move through different parts of the system, I should imagine.
RAE: Well, that's right. We want to set people up to get the care that they need as their needs evolve over time. As I said, a lot more people these days, Murray, want to be able to age at home for as long as possible. And we're seeing that borne out in the data. There are now the comprehensive supports in place to help people to do that. And indeed, people are often entering residential aged care at a different period of their life, usually a little more aged and often with some slightly different needs. But we do need to have a system that accounts for people ageing as they move through it and how their needs evolve. It's got to be focused on delivering for older people. The new Aged Care Act, which came into effect in November, it's a critical component of this, has a statement of rights that underpins every older Australian's right to aged care that meets their needs. And so when we're building this new system, those are the fundamental principles that we're constantly focused on. Of course, the system also needs to be sustainable and it needs to be equitable as well. So these are the challenges that we're dealing with when it comes to this massive public policy challenge ahead of us.
HOST: I'm speaking to the Minister for Aged Care and Seniors, Sam Rae. Sam, if we can talk about a bit of a different subject that's obviously very much front and centre in Australia at the moment, it's immigration. But one of the key challenges that you've got is actually filling some of the roles when it comes to aged care. And obviously, immigration plays a really important role in filling quite a few gaps that we've got in relation to aged care.
RAE: Well, you're absolutely right about that, Murray. In fact, immigration always been part of the Australian economic and social story, as we know. And look, to be fair, I think there is a legitimate conversation to be had across the community about what sustainable immigration looks like in order to make sure that we maintain quality of life in terms of housing and infrastructure provision as well as social services. But immigration is absolutely critical to our care economy and specifically to aged care. We have an incredibly highly skilled, dedicated workforce in the aged care sector. And I can't speak more highly, Murray, of the human beings that look after older people every single day. But as I said, with this ageing population and this explosive growth in demand for aged care services, we need to both be attracting young people into the aged care sector, of course, holding on to the experienced people that we've already got. But immigration also plays a role in bringing in really experienced, highly skilled workers from other countries that can help to meet that rapid rise in demand that we've got for services.
HOST: Yeah. And I guess striking that balance is always going to be the key to move forward here. Great to talk you. Some important things, and- I think particularly for our audience who are turning their mind to some of these challenges that may be ahead. Sam Rae is the Minister for Aged Care and Seniors. It's been great to talk to you this morning. Thank you so much for your time.
RAE: Thank you for having me, Murray.