Transcript – NHHRC Chair Dr Christine Bennett with Charles Woolley, Across Australia, 30 May 2008
Transcript
Item:
DR CHRISTINE BENNETT, CHAIRPERSON OF NATIONAL HEALTH AND HOSPITALS REFORM COMMISSION, TAKES CALLS FROM LISTENERS.
INTERVIEWEES:
CHRISTINE BENNETT, CHAIRPERSON, NATIONAL HEALTH AND HOSPITALS REFORM COMMISSION.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
And indeed, you might like to ring my first guest, Dr Christine Bennett, on 1300 655 141; because if you bang a drum long and loud enough, I think someone's bound to hear it and there'd be many people in the heartland, the rural doctors are just one of many groups banging the health drum for some time. And now, at least, there are some listeners and some professional listeners out there. The National Health and Hospitals Reform Commission has begun its tour of Australia listening to ideas on how the health system across the heartland can be improved. The chair of the commission is Dr Christine Bennett who joins me in the studio. Christine, have you been getting a bit of an earbashing? And welcome.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Thank you very much. Oh, it's been fantastic, actually; Tasmania has set the bar high as we start our tour around Australia.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Well, when I decided to do my show out of Tasmania - I could equally have done it from Bundaberg, or Bunbury, or…
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
[Laughs]
CHARLES WOOLEY:
… even the Gold Coast, I suppose - but one of the things about what we loosely call regional Australia, the thing that every place has in common is, vis-à-vis, the big smoke where two-thirds of Australians live, we have the longest hospital queues in all categories, the worst cardiac and disease rates, the worst cancer rates, the worst outcomes in all medical procedures. I could go on and on, couldn't I?
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Mmm.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
It's a grim, grim picture.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
And those inequities are one of the things we're particularly looking at. And it's actually, it's about health outcomes, but it's also about people's experience of the health service as well. And yo… as you say, the waiting or the lack of access. And while we can't have every possible service on every street corner in every small town, it's about making sure that we are - have got our eye on what's happening in those parts of Australia as well.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
The Australian Institute of Health and Welfare has just put out a report saying now that two million people a year wait in public hospital emergency departments for far longer than they should; and a further 17,000 wait more than 12 months in queues for elective surgery.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Mmm.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
And this country has never travelled so well; this is one of the most prosperous First World countries and a democracy - a democracy; why do we put up with it?
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
You know, the Australian health system is actually performing still quite well in regards to how much as a nation we're investing. And actually, one of the top performers in - it's number two on the life expectancy for our nation as a whole…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Well, I will concede, I'd rather get crook in Australia…
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Yes.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
… if I didn't have a quid…
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Yeah.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
… than in the United States of America.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Yeah, but these waiting times show it's a system under pressure and it's not sustainable and we've got to act now. So…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Tell me how - tell me how your listening system is working. What are you doing? What's the commission doing?
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Well, the commission has had a few months initially to get our thoughts together about the principles that we think should underpin a long-term plan for Australia, because this is a really special and unique opportunity actually where we're taking a long-term view.
We are going to look at action from now, but we're actually going to - try to actually work out where we are - we're trying to head, where's our destination, and head in that direction. So, we've got our principles and the particular areas we're looking at, we're out consulting, we've asked for submissions, not just from professionals and organisations and bodies, but actually from ordinary Australians.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
From the people who use the system…
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Yes, from people who use the system and people who might need to use the system one day, or who, you know, are well at the moment and wanting to know how they can stay healthy as well. So we've got a - on our website and an opportunity for people to email in their own thoughts as well; we'd love to hear from people.
But in addition to that we're actually doing this national tour. We're starting here in Hobart in Tasmania, and then we're going to each capital city of each state and territory and to four regional and rural areas, as well. And in those locations we're going to be talking to people, to people and families in the community; we're going to be talking to frontline health workers, who we think we've got a lot to learn from and, you know, this time here in Tassie has really demonstrated that.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
You would have noticed - and I notice of [indistinct], I mean, I know, for instance, in Orange, wonderful town that it is, not the place to need dentistry, because there's only a couple of dentists there and they're completely overworked.
Now, Hobart is a big city, a state capital as well as a regional one. I think there are only two neurologists, a great shortage of rheumatologists; and you'd have heard all this last night, wouldn't you?
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Yes, well, we've been hearing about the individual areas and their difficulty. And I suppose one of the things for the commission is that we're wanting to get all that information, but we, you know, we need to be frank about this; we can't solve every problem in the health system around Australia.
What we're trying to do is gather all of those issues - and, by the way, all of the really good ideas and suggestions and things that are working, because we heard about a lot of things that are working well - and then we want to sort of use those in how we design how the structure of the system and the financing of the system should work.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Curiously enough, money alone won't do it, will it?
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
No, not at all…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
I mean, money will not make te… doctors trained in the universities on the eastern seaboard, it will not make them go inland.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
You know, there's a couple of big challenges. We sen… tend to think of the problems in the health system being about more dollars or more beds, but really, there's some other very fundamental issues; one being the health workforce, and another being the fact that if we're really serious about our health, we've also got to look at what our role is in our health. And the third one is that there's a lot of waste in the system; there's a lot of inefficiency, people sitting in hospital beds…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
State-federal duplications.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Tha… but, yes, and we often talk about that whole blame game and cost shifting and the energy and time that goes into those things. Frankly, the dollars are not the only problem there; it's actually what care you end up getting and the gaps you fall through.
But the other thing also, though, on inefficiencies, are people sitting in hospital beds that don't actually need to be in a hospital bed, but there's nowhere else for them to be. There's no support for them…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
You mean lack of age care facilities and the like?
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Yes…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
And dementia patients sometimes in hospital beds…
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
That's [indistinct] the ping-ponging backward and forward between nursing homes and acute hospitals, or the lack of care for someone to stay in their primary home longer, or even in a, you know, hospital hotel, or in other words, a supported accommodation that isn't an acute hospital environment. Those options, specialty services in the community.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Go to any major hospital anywhere in Australia on a Friday and Saturday night and beds are taken up by people who have nothing else wrong with them except they're acutely drunk.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Well, there's a lot of…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
It's a big problem…
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
There's a lot of - yeah, a lot of s…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
In Cairns they complained about this…
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Mmm. Mmm…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
I mean, it actually takes up a huge percentage of their hospital beds every weekend.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Mmm. Or the night after pay day.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Yeah.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Mmm.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Yeah. How much do we spend on health in Australia? Do you have a figure off the top of your head?
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Yeah, look, just to round it up, and from all sources, around about $90 billion. So we're close to 10 per cent of GDP and about $90 billion and that's from
people's pockets direct.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Ten per cent of GDP, how does that stack up against the Brits or any European…
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Actually, we're travelling quite well; in fact, we're still sort of around about the ni… high nines. But - so Canada, for example, is around close to 14 per cent; the US is around 18 per cent; and you know, the Brits are a little bit lower than us, but we're just around average just a little higher than average on - in the OECD countries.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
If you wish to you can talk to Dr Christine Bennett on 1300 655 141. You can give her your opinions, that's what she's travelling around the country wanting to hear on the health system.
The thing that strikes me is that most of my callers are people who tell me stories that give a new meaning to roadside delivery, for instance, but we can't really expect a neurosurgery unit in Manilla; it's going to have to be hubbed, isn't it?
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Yeah, look, you know…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
And some things…
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Yeah.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
… are still going to have to go to the big smoke.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Yes. And look, I think it can be over-simplified; s… neurosurgeons are very important to delivering neurosurgery, but it's also about the multidisciplinary team; it's about the operating theatre team; the intensive care; the pathology; the radiology required to deliver that service safely; and often, if you have neurosurgical needs you've got other trauma needs.
So it's not just we want neurosurgery so we need a neurosurgeon; it's a whole lot of interdependent clinical care you need. And even for those sorts of people to keep their skills up and to justify that investment as well, you need a population and a volume that's actually going to keep them with their skills honed.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Christine, does anybody know in the medical profession for sure why it is that people listening to this program - and I don't just mean Indigenous people; I mean, it's also so for the white population of Australia - but for people listening to this program, their life expat… expectation is considerably shorter than that of someone who lives in the big smoke. Now, you would think living in the city with the stress, the pollution, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera, you would assume that country life was much more healthy, wouldn't you? And in fact, it isn't. Country life in Australia kills you earlier. Why?
CHRISTINE BENNETT: Yes, I - actually, we're looking at that data at the moment. There's certainly higher risks in the - in country Australia, but if you exclude the Indigenous community of rural Australia, then the life expectancies are not as great - in fact, they're a lot closer - so…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Yeah, but there's still a couple of years in it.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Yep. Yeah, there's - yeah…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Yeah. Yeah…
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
… but there's 17 years in…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Yeah, and when I'm 68, you know, hey, I want that extra couple of years, thank you very much; there are trout to catch.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Can we take a call? We've got Henry in Coffs Harbour. G'day, Henry. You can talk to Christine Bennett, head of the Health Commission.
HENRY:
Good morning, Charles, morning, Christine. How are you?
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Good morning, Henry.
HENRY:
Christine, my little beef is the fact that I suffer with glaucoma and it's an - it's a non-curable disease. I have to go back every six months to get a referral from an optometrist from my doctor to go back and see my eye specialist. Now that, to me, is double-servicing and over-servicing. And it all comes out the health care budget. It's only a little thing, but the point is, little things lead to big things.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Well, they do indeed. And it does - does sound like bureaucracy rather than care, Christine.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Yeah. I suppose the - the issue of the gatekeeper, or perhaps the gate opener, to higher cost services is really, I think, what Henry's referring to there too. And it is something that we're looking at. You know, I'm not going to pre-empt anything here, but sometimes though there might be other good reasons. So, for example, if you're suffering from high blood pressure and you have a specialist who looks after the renal disease that's the cause of that, it might be a good thing to go back to see your GP regularly in the process as well. So it's not always just about bureaucracy and limiting access to high cost services. But, you know, what - removing those sort of waste, those are sort of things - you know, even filling prescriptions, for example, where people are going back to refill a script, there might be a reason, if you're on the oral contraceptive, for example, that you should have your blood pressure checked and have an examination. But, on the other hand, it may be possible that you could have a quicker consultation than that and not necessarily with your GP.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Now, someone with a small point to make, like Henry, it's worth coming on to one of your meetings, isn't it?
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Yeah - well, actually, in a submission would be even more effective…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Or a submission.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
… because we're going to four locations in rural Australia.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Yeah. Hobart, Dubbo, Alice Springs, Cairns, Shepparton are places that I go to, But people can email you a submission.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
That's right - talkhealth@nhhrc.org.au.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Talkhealth@n...
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
… hhrc.org.au.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Okay. Thank you, Henry. You should - you should put what you've said into a - into an email and send it to that address. Theresa at Port Macquarie. G'day, Theresa.
THERESA:
Good morning.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Good morning to you. What have you got for Dr Christine Bennett?
THERESA:
Well, my - I come from a family, you know, we often have heart problems and all this. And I have a sister and a couple of family in Sydney that had angiograms, and every time they go they have her angiogram at the hospital and that's it. Well, Port Macquarie Hospital has now reverted back to what they call a public hospital, but my brother's gone and had one and he's had to contribute - he's 75 and he has to pay $100 towards the cost of these, you know, because it's owned - the x-ray department out there is run by private company.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Right. Well, that - that's...
CHARLES WOOLEY:
That sounds like a complicated one to me.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Well, it sounds like a local one but still, you know, it would be worth you sending that in, Theresa, so we can have a look at it. As I say, we unfortunately can't solve every single issue around Australia. But if that's a reflection of something that's happening more broadly, we'd really like to hear about it.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Theresa, if you're not an emailer yourself, someone in the family will be. And yeah. Send it to talkhealth@nhhrc.org.au. Even I can do that.
Christine, will you stay on for a wee while after the break?
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Very happy to.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
And yeah. And you can ring Christine Bennett, head of the Health Commission. She's here to hear what you've got to say about health, in this case, in regional Australia. You can ring her on 1300 655 141. And we'll be back in a moment.
[Unrelated items: program promo, ads]
CHARLES WOOLEY:
On 1300 655 141, still with Dr Christine Bennett, head of the Health Commission, who is on a listening mission across Australia. Christine, you're talking - we talk about health. I mean, it's hard to get your head round the whole scope. I mean, I had… we talk about a lot in this program. But I've had experts on telling me how dangerous the additives in our food are, and how there are additives in tucker here in Australia that have been long ago withdrawn in other countries.
We have a diabetes type two epidemic which is about unnecessary amounts of sugar. We have a binge drinking epidemic. Or maybe we don't. We argue about whether that's the case. But there is so much, isn't there?
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Mmm. It shows that our health goes beyond - and supporting our health goes beyond the direct health care system. It is something that our whole environment, our whole community, in many aspects, from local government through to the food manufacturers and our school system.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
So we're even talking school tuck shops. I mean, all of this you have to listen to on this trip.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Absolutely. And you know, even one of the things I reflect on with my children is they're very into climate change, and they know all about it. Well they need to also really know that their body is their responsibility, and understand how to look after it as well.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Yeah. Susan in Hervey Bay.
G'day Susan.
CALLER SUSAN:
Hello. How are you?
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Good. What do you think?
CALLER SUSAN:
Well, I'm fortunate enough not to be ill at this stage, and I really can't have anything w… bad to say about the health system. But I just wanted to complement them on the powers that be for having the sense to ask what the problems are before trying to put a solution into practice. I think that's commendable. And that's really all I wanted to say.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Okay. Thanks Susan. Oh well, there you are, somebody who's not throwing things. That's nice.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
No. And look, you know, we've only just started. But gee, it's been worthwhile already, actually.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
What surprised you in what you've heard so far.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Well I suppose I've actually been inspired and energised, frankly, by the - particularly the front line people who were just so much about their patients, the families, the people they're actually caring for.
I mean, it wasn't about the difficulties they're having, it was about that. And I suppose that the community group we spoke to last night, very much about you know, how do we consider these societal issues, the family structure, the supporting each other in their health.
And people are really giving a lot of thought to this.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Yeah. I think when you actually have … I mean, I obviously report shortcomings in the health systems, but when I've used it myself because of one of the kids, or my dad dying in palliative care, and you are - or childbirth. You are always enormously impressed by the dedication and professionalism of Australian health workers. So it must be heartbreaking for them that so many of the stories - and rightly so - are negative ones.
Rightly so, because the outcomes aren't good.
But it must be very sad when you have so many good birthing outcomes that the headlines are always the woman who gives birth in the lavatory in the hospital because of the - because of a waiting list.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Mm. Yeah, last night actually, we did hear some very heartwarming and positive stories as well, and a number of the staff, I think, are very stressed because they're wanting to give a higher level of care and personalise that care, and there isn't the time in the pressures of the system at the moment.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Yeah, well, there are some hospitals in Hobart, mine is one of them, where good professionals leave because they're frustrated.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Mm.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
So we need to make a good workplace for them.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Well, we had one woman last night who's been in nursing for 30 years, and she's come in and out of the profession five times. So, you know, she was very passionate about having nurses who want to be nurses in our system, and supported.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
We've got a nurse on the line, actually. Lee, in central Queensland, hello Lee.
Hello Lee? No. Can I - can we get line three, line one?
Problem here.
All right. I'll take, no line one, here we go. Communications. Bloody technology.
Lee, in central Queensland, hello?
CALLER LEE:
Yeah, actually, I'm on [indistinct]. How are you?
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Well. That's a very nice part of the world.
CALLER LEE:
It is. It's a little bit overcast today, hopefully we'll get some rain…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Well, good, you need.
CALLER LEE:
…needed on the coast.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
You're a nurse?
CALLER LEE:
Yeah, I've been a nurse, one of those ones, for 30 years too. But I…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
[Interrupts] Good, well, talk to Christine Bennett.
CALLER LEE:
Yeah. Christine, I was actually - I've actually worked both in the public and the private sector; I now currently work in the private sector. And I actually work in a small emergency centre attached to a private hospital.
And one of the things that I sort of noticed is that, you know, the two strings - one in the private sector, you have a lot of elderly people who, I sort of feel that often believe that because they've paid their private health insurance, they're entitled to a bed for things that probably don't need to occupy a bed.
We also find in our area that a lot of the things you learn about, as growing up as parents, or as we're taught as parents, from our parents, is how to manage simple things. And a lot of people present for care, who, you know, if they just sort of managed it at home, and took some panadol, the fevers would go away, the vomitting would settle, but you know, people turn up for the simplest things. And you know, I'm sure that's happening in the public system as well, and that's why our emergency areas are so overloaded, is that people just can't manage simple illnesses or simple conditions anymore, you know?
CALLER LEE:
Mm.
CALLER LEE:
Yeah. Go on?
CALLER LEE:
No, no, absolutely Lee. And I think, I think really the issue is that we've ended up with a system that's so dependent upon hospitals. I mean, if you are older, and you're uncertain what's going on or what to do, or you're caring for a partner who's older as well, and you know, you just don't know what to do, or you fall or you physically can't manage it; there aren't options other than the hospital. And if there were more home based care, or you know, a helpline were people could say, this is happening, what should I do. Or, you know, someone does need some physical care that's beyond their home based carer, there might be a sort of a more hospital hotel style, where there's some supported accommodation, but you know, not the full on acute care.
CALLER LEE:
Yeah, the oth…
CALLER LEE:
So, you know, I think…
CALLER LEE:
[Interrupts] The other thing I find is GPs, it's an issue too. Because I think some of the people who live in the rural and the remote areas, probably do better with their general practitioners than we do in our regional centres, because the general practice, general practitioners really do not offer after hours service, most of them, and therefore, you know, they're - the, you know, community has to rely on the hospitals to manage their after hours conditions.
Whereas, if you live in, say, somewhere small country town, that GP is around, he seems to be available, and makes himself available to the community 24 hours. They pay a price often, because they don't have, you know, lots of breaks or things.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Yes, they do, their families pay too, yeah.
CALLER LEE:
Yeah.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
You're quite right.
CALLER LEE:
But you know, certainly, having your doctors available - and it's certainly much better if people can be managed by their GPs, rather than by a transitory program where they come in and are managed by somebody else for a few days, and then, back home again. There seems to be just this gap between, you know, being able to manage to get the GP content to have a service that offers more for people, you know.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Yeah.
CALLER LEE:
Particularly the elderly, you know. They just don't have the access to transport, to get to their services, and…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
[Interrupts] No, no. I've been through this with the - with the death of my dad over the Christmas break, and mum, who was 90, nursing him, well, she's 91 now. And it seems quite good, I mean, initially you learn there's a community nursing support service. But then you learn that it's nine to five. And of course, most crises don't happen nine to five, Monday to Friday.
Do you think that in a way, nursing can - as it does in China, in rural China - that actually trained nurses take up a lot of this role?
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Look, the roles and redesigning the roles of health professionals is something that's being brought to us, and we're considering as well. I mean, there's nurses, very highly trained nurses as well, who operate as practitioners in their own right. There are paramedics as well, who, we heard a lot from the ambulance people here in Tassie too. So there are a lot of other very highly trained people who, you know, could be able to do more. But also, are looking for options of where to then refer someone to if they can't stay in their home, other than just the acute hospital.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Let's take another quick couple of calls. Dr Alexander, who's a regular caller to this program, in Hobart. G'day mate.
CALLER ALEXANDER:
Hi, how are you?
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Good.
CALLER ALEXANDER:
Look, I'm in my car, travelling from a nursing home to surgery, so I…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Yeah.
CALLER ALEXANDER:
[Indistinct] for that.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Okay.
CALLER ALEXANDER:
What I hear, coming from the Commission is, could only be described as fiddling while Rome burns. This system of proposed substitues will be a system that will have to be accessed by rural Australians and the less well-off. Well-off city dwellling Australians will access a well qualified doctor or - but this idea of nurse practitioners. Where will they fit into the system? Who will they be responsible to?
I heard you describe a consultation a while ago, that doesn't even exist, where someone just pops in for a pill prescription. Good Australian trained GPs call it a well woman check. You come in, you get your moles checked, your blood pressure checked, your breasts checked, your pap smear, and have a - then, as a really minor thing at the end, repeat the pill prescription.
This idea that's fragmenting the system with less qualified substitutes is madness, and while it's happening, hundreds and thousands of health workers, and most particularly, hundreds and hundreds of GPs are quitting every week. Who is going to train the new workforce you proposed? Who is going to be responsible for this new workforce? Who is going to imdenify this new workforce?
CHARLES WOOLEY:
They're good questions, Christine, and I know that Dr Alexander, like so many Australian medicos that I talk to across the heartland, is just frustrated.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Yeah, yeah.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
I mean, the bloke's overwhelmed.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
We're hearing this as well. Look, Dr Alexander, I have to say, I just wanted to clarify one thing, in my comment about the well women, the woman coming in for her oral contraceptive. I was actually trying to emphasise your point, that it isn't just a simple rewrite of a script, there are other reasons why it'd be important for the woman to see that GP regularly.
But we are hearing from GPs as well, of course, and we do see that primary care general practitioners, and the whole multi-disciplinary team out there, in primary care being a fundamental part of the system; in fact, vital, and probably one of the biggest focuses of the work of the commission.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Okay, Dr Alexander, thank you for your call.
Christine, do you want to flee from the studio, or can you stay for a few minutes more?
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
I'm fine.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Terrific.
We're on 1300 655 141, we'll continue to take calls with Dr Christine Bennett, who's here to hear, and she's head of the Health Commission.
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CHARLES WOOLEY:
I'm with Dr Christine Bennett, head of the Health Commission. She's travelling around Australia to hear your opinions, and she can hear them now. A little later before she goes I'll tell you where else in my stations or my towns where you're listening across the heartland where you can go to make a submission. Or, Christine, people can make a submission, can't they, by email to…
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Talkhealth…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Talkhealth@nhhrc. Is that National Health and…
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Hospitals Reform Commission.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Hospitals Reform Commission. Right.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Yes, that's the mystery [laughs].
CHARLES WOOLEY:
… dot org dot au. It's a mouthful though, isn't it?
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Yes.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
We take Sue in Coffs Harbour. G'day Sue.
CALLER SUE:
Good morning George. Thank you for taking my call.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Oh George, I'm Charlie.
CALLER SUE:
Charlie. Sorry, Charlie.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
That's all right. There's a great man called George. I don't mind the confusion.
CALLER SUE:
[Laughs] I actually spoke to you about eight months ago. I'm actually a cancer consumer, and I hate that title. That means I actually have had cancer. And I'm in Coffs Harbour and I'm fairly high profile, particularly in women's issues. I had a gynaecological cancer, Christine, which kind of makes me one of those ones that a lot of people don't want to talk about. But there's a drum to beat and I'm probably the one to do it. Eleven years ago I was diagnosed. And with the health system the way it is in regional areas, I was fast-tracked to Sydney. And, bravo, it was brilliant. I met a fantastic doctor who unfortunately is no longer with us through tragedy of his own. But he was just brilliant. And the service that was provided for me at Royal North Shore Hospital was also sensational.
The issues arise when you're flown back to where you live, you know, which is 700 kilometres away and you then go and speak to your GPs and the communications for regional patients with the specialist services that are provided, in my opinion, and fairly quickly, and then the lack of support in rural areas.
And my other drum to beat is for gynaecological services for women in this area. Because my cancer actually reoccurred another five years after that - so I've had two outbreaks of a gynaecological cancer. I've had my full groin and lymphatic system removed which makes me susceptible to a cellulitis condition which is an acute condition that can come and go as it kind of likes. Which puts me in front of emergency services at hospitals, and makes me look for gynaecological support.
And in our area we've got very little of that. In fact, not only have we got very little, we have very aged gynaecological male support. We have no females here that I'm aware of. And…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
And you're not exactly in remote Australia, are you, at Coffs Harbour either. It's a big growth area.
CALLER SUE:
You're absolutely right. Not only is it a growth area for young people, and we're all producing beautiful children, we've also got a very aged - you know, we've got…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
We have a lot of sea changers moving there.
CALLER SUE:
Yeah, it's quite a dynamic - as far as that goes. And health support services - they've built us this most beautiful hospital but I'm acutely aware of the shortages, particularly at emergency services and bed shortages. And actually my mother also - and she may be listening because we're all fans of your wonderful broadcast - was diagnosed just before Christmas with lung cancer. So now I'm actually seeing it from the carer's point of view the facilities.
Mind you, she has been looked after extremely well with a more generic - and I hate to use that word -but they have more information and more support…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Okay, Sue, thanks. I'll get a response from Christine. Christine, I think you'll hear a lot more of this from Cairns as well actually.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Mmm. You know what, what interests me on this one, Sue, is - and I'd like to ask you a question if that's okay - is… you know, you've said you've been an advocate and you've been outspoken. What sort of voice have you been given? Where have you approached locally those issues, and how's the response been met? Because these issues are going to be, you know, across many areas and I'm just wanting - we're looking at how we can have effective public voice, if you like, injected into local health services. I'm wondering what your experience was.
CALLER SUE:
Well, actually, that's a really great question. Being a survivor of cancer and having two young children at the same time really ties your hands up initially. But my drum's been beating and I've been trained up the Cancer Services of New South Wales, and they'd be very happy - the regional advocacy group - will be happy to hear that I've been able to get in communication with you directly, which is always a passion for the people.
I've also spoken with business groups of women about my journey with - I've talked to Rotary groups of mixed age groups. And my GP. And actually what's really been fascinating for me, two doctors were recruited and actually lived right next door to me, which was - you know, I saw firsthand that doctors are recruited from Canada and South Africa. Very young, husband and wife team. They actually moved from Western Australia to Coffs Harbour to work in our base hospital here. And the commitment made by the hospital to keep them here wasn't kept. They actually were offered better money from the Queensland Government. And the deals that - so you've got bargaining happening at that level.
So these - I've had some direct dealings with the public and with the medical profession. And that's just a couple of things.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Sue sounds like a useful person to have onside. Sue, are you making a submission to talkhealth@nhhrc.org.au?
CALLER SUE:
Absolutely and…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Good.
CALLER SUE:
And I've just made one for the tobacco paper that's been put through the Government too about children and tobacco, liquor - licensing laws. So…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Well, that's another side of it too, isn't it. That's the health industry you're talking about.
Yes, Sue, thank you very much for talking to us. We'd better move on. We've got people everywhere wanting to talk to you now, Christine Bennett. And some of them will see you in person, but probably not Tony up at Tumut.
G'day Tony.
CALLER TONY:
How ya goin' mate?
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Good mate, and you?
CALLER TONY:
Oh, very well thanks.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
You sound very hearty.
CALLER TONY:
Oh mate, you've got [indistinct] where we're living.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Yes, you do. It's a good healthy place and when you've got a bit of water, some good fishing. What have you got to talk to Dr Christine Bennett about, mate?
CALLER TONY:
Well, about the doctors, well mate, I had - I was like [indistinct]. I had - I'm a survivor… cancer survivor, and I had two tumours on the brain. Now these doctors were always beside me all the time. They - anything ever happened to me when I was in hos… in Prince of Wales Hospital when I was two, they come and rung me mum up without no questions. They asked me parents how am I going and all this. And they didn't even stop and think about, you know - one night there was even one nurse sitting there and just watching me, and just saying, you know, you've got a nice beautiful son and all this. But that's beside the point.
Beside -the point is there's good top doctors out there. People want to stop and realise that, you know, one day we might need those doctors and they're very hard to find. Yes, I know that.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
So you're ringing as a happy customer.
CALLER TONY:
Well look, you've got to be happy mate…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
And Christine Bennett needs to hear a bit of these too.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Yes, really appreciate that actually, Tony.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Okay, thanks Tony.
Lesley in Manildra. G'day Lesley.
CALLER LESLEY:
Oh hi Charles.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Where's Manildra?
CALLER LESLEY:
Beg your pardon?
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Manildra? Is there a pub? Is there a butcher shop?
CALLER LESLEY:
Oh, there's a butcher shop and a hotel and a bowling club and a golf club…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
I don't think you're going to Manildra, Christine.
CALLER LESLEY:
… and 500 people.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Five hundred people.
CALLER LESLEY:
Yes.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
We'd love to hear from Manildra though.
CALLER LESLEY:
Yeah. Well, I'm another happy customer with the health system that we have in Australia. We don't have any complaints about it except about the shortage of doctors.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Yes.
CALLER LESLEY:
That is the only complaint that we people in Manildra have, that we don't have a doctor here.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Where's your nearest doctor?
CALLER LESLEY:
At Molong.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Oh, right.
CALLER LESLEY:
Which is 25 k's away.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Yes, I know Molong.
CALLER LESLEY:
Oh, do you?
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Yes, I do indeed. Lovely old historical town.
CALLER LESLEY:
Yes.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Got a bit of a flood a year or so back. If you wanted to actually go to a meeting and voice your concern, you could make the big hike to Dubbo 2 and 3 June.
CALLER LESLEY:
Right, okay.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Because Christine will be there and listening.
CALLER LESLEY:
Right. Okay then, Charles, thank you very much.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Okay, okay.
CALLER LESLEY:
I'd just like to say how much we enjoy your program.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Oh, thank you very much. I didn't know that I go to Manildra. I will…
CALLER LESLEY:
Oh yes.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
And now that I know there's a pub and a butcher shop I'll look out for it on the way through.
CALLER LESLEY:
[Laughs]
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Thank you Lesley.
CALLER LESLEY:
Just don't blink.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
[Laughs]
CHARLES WOOLEY:
I thought I'd travelled around Australia so much in my television life, but I still find towns - people ring me from towns that, to my shame, I don't know. And there is no book that tells you either, believe it or not, Christine. You will discover places you haven't heard of on this listening tour.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
That's right.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
So let's - just before you go, and I do thank you for your time. You've been very good.
Dubbo, New South Wales, 2 and 3 June; Alice Springs, 11 and 12 June. And I guess it will be posted in the papers so people will know where to go?
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Actually, Charlie, can I just say that we have - we're trying to contain the forums as well so…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
So you don't me to…
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
No, no, no, I do want to say where they are. If people are interested in coming could they please also email that site, that talkhealth…
CHARLES WOOLEY:
This very difficult site. talkhealth@nhhrc.org.au. I think we've all got it now.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
We've also got a 1800 number too.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Yeah, give me the 1800 number.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
1800 017 533.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Dr Christine Bennett, I wish you well on your listening tour. Somebody - it's cold and lonely work, I imagine, but somebody's got to do it.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
Actually, it's just fantastic meeting so many people.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Well, that's good. And you'll get a few brickbats but you're getting some bouquets as well, aren't you.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
No, that's great. Thanks.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Thank you very much. And before you go, because I believe in health as well as treatment, I am a co-author of a book, A Walk in Old Hobart, and it's a way - we should have them in every city in Australia. And if I had my way I would. And it's just a way of walking around. A two hour walk, very healthy and you'll learn a bit of history about your country.
CHRISTINE BENNETT:
That's fantastic.
CHARLES WOOLEY:
Okay. Dr Christine Bennett, thank you.
Page currency, Latest update: 05 June, 2008